Bonjhola

EP 38 - FLASHBACK - Aimee's Trip to the States: She Finds Less Value in Objects While Her Child Gets High on Consumerism

• Rebecca West

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Bonjola, this is Amy. This month we want to share a series of flashback episodes detailing all of the travel that we've done in the spring and summer, and some of the things that we're taking away from that experience. So, what you're going to be hearing this month are actually recordings that we did as early as May 2024, moving in throughout the summer. In October, we'll resume more current episodes detailing our autumn and transition into the holiday season. Thanks for listening! Welcome to Bonjola, a podcast about two women, Amy and Rebecca, who each moved from the United States to Europe to become expats, Amy to Spain and Rebecca to France. We're here to share the highs, the lows, and the logistics of this adventure, encourage you to follow your own move abroad dreams, and remind you that you're not alone when the going gets tough. Enjoy.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Bonjola, Amy.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Bonjoula, Rebecca.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

It's been a little while since we last recorded. You have been away in, on the American continent.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Yes.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

And when I last talked to you, you were planning on doing a lot of stocking up and grabbing of things. But I hear that now that you have moved things from one storage unit to another, you were less inclined to buy a bunch more stuff. You want to talk about that?

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Yeah. You know, I mean, when I went back to the States in November, I had a very clear sense of what I needed to get, what I was missing. It was very fresh in my mind perhaps because I was still fresh abroad. Right. And, uh, ironically we, ended up having our one year anniversary of leaving the States while we were in the States.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

funny.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Yeah. Yeah. It's just the way that kind of, that cookie crumbled. Um, and because I was so focused on preparing to come back and, you know, working through my Spanish to try and pass that class, I was not as focused on all of the different things that I wanted to bring back. You know, I had a general sense we were going to go through the storage unit. I knew I was going to find stuff and so I didn't really need to make a huge list because I knew opening up the, the, the 10 by 8 foot Christmas package was going to give me everything that I could possibly want. Right. Um, and I also had a lot of stuff shipped to my sister over the last six months that were waiting for me. Because, um, I knew I was going back to the States for her wedding. And so I started sending her stuff, you know, As things were coming on sale, as I realized there was something I missed. Um, I just had it shipped to her house since the, we were going there for her wedding

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

That's smart.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Yeah. Yeah. And that was great. It was a really great, I also had, uh, two duffel bags with wheels mailed to her. So that way we only brought over three suitcases, but we came back with five.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Also smart. Very clever planning ahead.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

And the great thing about those duffel bags is that, you know, in the future, when we go back to the States, we can just roll them up, put them in the suitcase. And then, and you, you know, you can't do that with other suitcases unless you have, you know, smaller sizes that nest. So great tip for anybody who's planning on schlepping their stuff bit by bit as we are, that is one way that you can do it. So by time we arrived in Seattle, which was the last leg of our trip. You know, we, we went to my sister's wedding and then we flew to my hometown. And then, you know, visited with family for a couple of weeks and then flew to Seattle to move the storage unit and see all of the people we know in Seattle because we're in town before coming, coming back to Europe. And, we moved the storage unit pretty much straight away after we landed. Uh, it was within a couple of days. And after that, I just didn't care about all of the things that I thought I wanted. I had half a suitcase full of stuff that I had shipped to my sister. I felt very complete on that end. There were a couple of items that we took care of immediately when we were in Oregon because there's no sales tax. So we upgraded our electronics and I picked up a couple of, you know, random things and so by time we got to Seattle I just didn't,

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Question on the electronics. Um, are they significantly more expensive in Europe? Is it that you didn't want the European adapters? Like, why, what, what, what? Sorry. Why did you make that choice?

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

everything is quite a bit more expensive here. My phone Uh, was about, let's see, I think my phone was 900, no tax in Oregon, and it would have been a thousand euros plus the, um, IVA tax

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

So significantly more, much more money.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

really significant for some reason, the phone. Cost more than the laptops, the laptops were like, you know, whatever it is in us dollars, same numerical value, but in euros. So, you know, 1, euros. And so you're, you know, by buying in the store, With where the Euro dollar exchange rate is as of this recording was basically a 10 percent savings. And then with the extra tax that was added to the cell phone, that was an additional 20%.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Yeah.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

And so it ended up, you know, saving us several hundred dollars to just go to. Uh, state that didn't have sales tax, which happened to be the state my sister was getting married in. So it worked out really well. Spend what felt like way too much at the Apple store, but actually saved us quite a bit had we not been patient and purchased everything over

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

And what were the things, what kinds of things did you have shipped to your sisters? Are these personal care or like what, like what kinds of stuff were you?

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Yeah, I found a really huge, I found a bottle or a, I found a sunscreen that I really like. It's not greasy. It has zinc in it, but it blends in and so you don't have like white, you know, you don't look like a ghost. And there was a sale going on for like a huge vat of it, like a liter size bottle. So I was like, I want that and I won't have to buy a sunscreen for five years. It'll be great. Some of these were impulse buys, I have to admit,

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Yeah. But when you find a product that works for you, it takes so long to find it in the first place. This is one of the things I am on the verge of running out of my face lotion. Do I spend way too much money having it shipped to me, a brand that isn't available here, or do I explore the French brands, which I mean, skincare here is amazing. But the journey of finding products for your body, I mean, I don't know if men go through this, but as a female, I feel like I've spent my lifetime building up my library and I don't want to start over.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

I mean, I think most, at least most heterosexual men don't, I think, have an interest in body

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Right.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

besides manscaping.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

All right. So some personal care stuff. Your electronics and anything else that did make the cut before you stopped caring.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Yes, spices. I did stock up on spices. I think I must have spent like 200 on spices from the two spice shops that I reliably go to. One, um, One in my hometown and then one in Seattle, um, world spice market for those of you who are in the Pacific Northwest. So I had pickling spice. I don't recall if we've talked about pickles on the podcast or if that's been off the podcast,

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

between us. Yeah, but Interesting how much trouble you've had finding this is not something I would have expected to be hard in Europe But you have definitely not been able to find some of the spice blends that you've been looking for and I know that when my husband And I were looking for cayenne pepper flakes red pepper flakes

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

not a

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

No, it's astonishing.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

right?

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Like it's like, like they love to cook. They love food. There was the whole spice trade that made everybody so rich back in the day. Like what, where did they go? Was it all just currency? They didn't actually ever cook with any of it. I'm so confused. So, but you have your spices now. Congratulations.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

have my spices stocked up on a whole boatload of chilies, so that way I don't have to worry about pozole this Christmas, or salsa, or, you know, having some heat, because Spaniards, you know, Spaniards, they brought back the peppers. They brought back potatoes. They do not like chiles, and they do not like spicy food here. So, I'm taking care of that. I made sure to take care of that. My tortilla press did not make the cut. I was, we have really missed tortillas, like real tortillas, what they do here. I don't know if they're just using a different kind of corn, or someone suggested that maybe they're not using lime in the masa, and that's why their tortillas are just off here. They're not. Correct.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

So you brought out your tortilla press, but you didn't choose to bring it home.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

I brought up my tortilla press. I was going to get some masa and bring back masa so that I had, you know, the real stuff. Not trust whatever they're selling here, because it would be a bummer to lug this metal heavy tortilla press all the way across Europe and then not have the appropriate masa available to make

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Yes.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

And it was just, it was just heavy. I didn't have a good way to wrap it that I felt comfortable, you know, taking it on the airplane in a duffel bag. And I was just like, I don't care. I've lived a year without corn tortillas. I can live another year without corn tortillas. It'll be fine. Maybe I'll bring it next time. And so I put it back and that's kind of, that ended up kind of being my attitude about the whole thing is I've lived without it this long. It'll be fine. I don't need it that badly. Now, mind you, I've only been back in Europe for a couple of days. So in two or three weeks, I may be kicking myself for not getting fresh batch of tahini to put on my watermelon, you know, given that it's 90 degrees out right now. but right now I just like, I just feel too tired to care about those little things. I didn't, Want to trouble myself with the mental gymnastics of packing, the decision making process, the whittling down process. And it was really nice to have everything that we intended to take back on our first go of it. Meet the weight. Requirements set by the airlines, when we moved over initially, and then when I was back last winter, had to do a lot of culling, you know, to, to meet those requirements. And that was not a thing this year. My husband graciously reminded me that I needed winter clothes and I had not brought winter clothes to Europe the first time. So I did bring back some winter coats that I had saved. My New Year's Eve outfit, which didn't make the cut last winter. So I can wear it this year. Um, and there were so, so there were some clothes and a lot of shoes I brought back.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Well, and you say you, you mentioned that you were too tired to care, but I also have noticed in my own life and in our conversations that our priorities seem to shift by doing this expat thing. Partly there's the cultural influence of, of just literally a different way of seeing the world. There's the influence of, of, of. The big move and being like, I don't need all this stuff because I think with our first move, we're like, I don't know, I might miss this and this and this and this, and then by the time you're done lugging it all with you, you're like, yeah, actually I care less about these things than I thought I would. The problem is you don't know what those things will be until you've done the first lug.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Very true. I have heard very consistently from many people on the internet that those who ship their households over, who ship furniture over, who ship vehicles over inevitably regret

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Yeah, well,

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

the furniture doesn't fit in a European apartment and then they're stuck with it. They open up a box and they're like, why did I even pack this? I don't need this. And there's, I know for myself, there is. That fear of the unknown and the fear of missing something that becomes needed, which I imagine is very similar to, to all of our, all of our ancestors who, who survived the depression era. Right. I might need this someday. I'd hate to get rid of this and then regret it later on. So let me just hold onto it or let's just bring it. And that's not, maybe it's. Yeah, it's just not as pressing once you're here.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

there's also, at least for me, and this I'm sure is informed by my work as an interior designer. Um, but even before it was my career, my surroundings have always been a big part of how I define myself. Um, my surroundings, my clothes, my jewelry, these are all have always been sort of markers of, okay, well that's Rebecca and now living a pretty nomadic lifestyle moving every three to six months and stuff. I'm not choosing to spend money on things that I won't get to enjoy for longer than a few months. And then, and then that partnered with the fact that Europeans don't seem to define themselves the same way by their personal surroundings, their outfit, their wardrobes seem to be simpler or at least pared down. And so I am feeling this. I'm feeling less of a need to define myself that way. And I'm finding other ways to define who I am in the world. So that's been part of the shift for me too. It's like literally I'm seeing the world differently than I used to on top of all the rest of it.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

It surprises me living in Paris that you feel that people don't represent themselves through their fashion because Paris is such a fashion Mecca for the world. And I certainly feel here in Spain that a lot of people do express themselves through their clothing. They tend to. Like, you know, who has, you know, probably what we would call new money in the States based on how they dress and, and how poofy their lips are and the brand of purse that they're carting around. And even, you know, the Arab women here will express their individuality through the designs and the colors of the clothing they wear, the type of purse that they carry, because this is a way that they can express themselves. Stand apart, right. Or, or show up or express themselves. And I would expect, I would expect the same from Paris. So I'm really surprised to hear that.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

I was, I was definitely expecting the same thing too. And it's not that they don't take. Immaculate care of their appearance, but the end result is very natural hair. There's not like crazy hairstyles or dyed hair. All the color tends to be natural or natural looking, you know, we're all walking around in the wind and taking the Metro and stuff, so they're not going to over curl and do their hair. I think that's where it's coming from. They're wearing a fair amount of makeup, but it's all very, very natural looking. A lot of the self care is more about. Like getting a facial, like caring, literally caring for your skin, not covering it up with a mask. Their clothes fit well. They're well taken care of. They're well tailored. And I've noticed that the shoes and the bag, they aren't ostentatious, not flashy, but again, they're in good repair. They are quality. So I think. That the American lens of what it would mean to be fashionable. I was picturing like noticeable fashion. And as there's an understatement where it's like, instead of the clothes wearing them, which I think happens for a lot of us when we go for the Emily in Paris effect. They are wearing the clothes. The clothes are there to adorn the women and the clothes are not, and the men, both the clothes are not there to speak for themselves. They are there to adorn the person wearing them. It is, it is, it is so hard to describe. And there's a person I follow on Instagram. I think her name is madam tartan. I don't know. Um, but anyway, She was helping us do one of those, get ready with me posts. And she also was trying to describe, okay, so like they dress up, but not like formal, like you don't have to wear a dress. And she also having lived here for 10 years was having trouble getting her words around, what does it mean to dress French? Because it's not, I think how any of us Americans think it's going to be when you get here,

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

That makes sense to me. I like on that vein, I, you know, my sister's wedding was very casual. And so I was thinking, okay, casual. I don't want to go in shorts, you know, and I brought, I brought what would be considered casual for going out here in Spain, a, um, cream colored satiny tank top with, with, um, flowers that kind of crawled up the, the neck line. And dark blue linen pants with a

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

perfectly European.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

And my aunt says something to the effect of look rich and chic. And I was like, Oh shit, that's not what I'm going for here at all.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

That's what I'm talking about. It's like.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

classy. That's what it was rich and classy. And I was like, Oh crap. Going for casual,

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

And it's sort of like, I don't know that a French woman can walk into a room and not have the effect of being, know, what were the words you finally landed on there and

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

rich and classy. I think, yeah.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

partly too, we cannot forget, first of all, they're all fit, right? So that's one part of it, which automatically makes you look like you have more money

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Mm hmm.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

They are standing up straight. And that posture has a huge amount to do with looking confident, looking poised, which again, we associate with wealth and class. It's fascinating.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

That is fascinating.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

How, what was your impression going home looking at people's bodies, clothing, fashion, uh, loudness levels? Like, what did you notice?

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

I don't know if it's because I work exclusively with Americans and mostly with weight loss. I didn't seem to notice the change in body size. But my, you know, my husband was kind of like, Oh my God, everybody here is so much bigger. It was like, yes, dear. We spin that way. Yep. It's, it's a thing. It's a thing. Um, definitely You know, when I think about how people looked, right, particularly on the West coast, there was, you know, there's a lot of like, look at me, I have bright hair color and look at, look at how I'm different.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Less. Hm.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Yeah. Look at, look at how I'm different and how I'm special. And that's my, I guess that's my layer of judgment on it. Look at how I'm special. So, and it, and it's funny because I, you know, I think people do that to express their individuality, but they all do it the same way. And so they they look like. So it's like, well, you know, we're all one species, but then there's these people over here who look like this because they all have, you know, the side of their head shaved and a faux Hawk and, or a mullet, and it's a bright color that doesn't exist in the natural world and they all look the same, even though they're trying so hard to be different. So I did notice that not so much, not so much in my hometown, which is actually a fairly conservative place, but certainly on the West Coast and the, the frantic rushedness of everything, which. Due to the nature of some of the things that I needed to do while I was home, I immediately slipped into and hit the ground running like it was second nature and just rode that adrenaline rush of the checklist. Next thing, next thing, next thing, crack at this, crack at this, get this done. For the three weeks of the five weeks. It was very, very intense. most of it was expected. Some of it was not, it was a little extra special just for just because. So it was, I think the thing that bothered me the most was how easy it was, how, how easily I forgot Spain, like not even thinking about it. All of my future projecting was mostly about what still needs to be done while I'm here. What things can't get done while I'm here that will necessitate me coming back. What long term future possibilities look like. From the vantage point of actually being in the States and not being able to stay in Spain. and I had to consciously remind myself that all of the future tripping I have ever done has never come to pass the way I think

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

course. Yes.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

and that, I have to stay open to the possibility of this and that rather than immediately jumping to you can't have the dream. You have to come home. There's too much to take care of here that no one but you can do. Um, and my poor family was just along for the ride,

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

But, you know, you bring up an important aspect of being an expat, you know, we've talked about it before when we were talking about saying goodbye to friends and some of the we can feel, and just the exploration of friendships, but family. I think you described, a sandwich generation. I think that's what we are, I guess, with our parents. And then for those of us who have children, not me, the caretaking aspect of who you're responsible for. I think is always present, especially for women, but it's really heightened by being an ex pat. And then those things you worry about. For me, at least they're coming earlier. Like I think about my parents who are all in very good health right now, but now their health is very top of mind because what are my responsibilities to my parents, when are they going to, as a, as a responsibility, when is it going to rear its head? What am I going to do? And, and to your point. I can't, worrying about it is pointless because I don't know when it'll hit and when it does, the answers will reveal themselves. So when I find myself falling down that hole, I definitely try to just say, that's not happening now.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Exactly.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

It's not saying it's easy, but yeah,

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

But it's not today.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

today. Um, before we wrap up though, speaking of Fashion. You told me that your son discovered Walmart.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Yes. And it has nothing to do with fashion. So my child discovered stumble guys here in Spain, which is yes, exactly. I don't know what is that? He discovered it as trading cards and actually he found them first in France

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Okay. So this is a game, a collecting cards game or something.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

trading. Yeah. Collectible trading cards. And he said, what are these? And so we bought some cause they were cheap. And he was like, Oh, these are fun. And then he discovered that he can get them here in Spain. And so we started collecting these trading cards. And then he discovered that the trading cards are connected to a video game. So he plays the video game. And then through that somehow, or probably just getting online and looking around, he discovered that there are mini figurines and figurines and even plushes of some of these stumble guys, and they're at Walmart. So his mission going to the United States was, was very, very focused. It was, we have to go to every single Walmart we find. To see if I can find stumbled guys to purchase. And then I have to see all my friends.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Priorities one and then two.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

And then the third was eating at all of his favorite restaurants in Seattle. So.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Side note here, having grown up in the Midwest, it is like inconceivable to me that your child at 10 years old hasn't been to a Walmart. So I know that they're not as prevalent on the West coast, but still my mind is a little bit blown right now.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

He's been to Walmart. He just didn't care because it was just a store like every other

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Okay. But now he was on a mission.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Now he's on a mission and being 10 years old instead of like four or five or six years old, he has, he has money, you know, from taking out the trash and doing various activities. And he's decided he has something he wants to spend his money on. And so going into a Walmart. To purchase these things. And then of course he sees all the other things. It's like, Oh my gosh, this is so cheap. And we discovered, we discovered lemonade flavored sour patch kids, which are. Amazing. Amazing might be my new favorite running candy because on my longer runs, I always bring like a gummy or something like that for fuel. Um, Yeah, they're really good. They're dangerously good. And so, so with his 10 year old budget, he has a lot of possibilities at Walmart that he didn't realize were his until now.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

So did he get his stumble guy things? Was it successful? Was it successful?

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

He did get, he did get what he wanted and then he discovered the, rediscovered the dopamine hit of shopping. And so there was his, the initial things he wanted to get. And then after he got them a couple of days later, he, he needed another hit. And so he's like, well, let's go back. And I want to maybe get this, this and this. Well, Walmart doesn't have this stumble guy, but I found it on eBay and I'm totally willing to pay this price to get it shipped. And then he's trying to, you know, figure out, well, is it, should we have it shipped where there's no sales tax or should we have it shipped, but the shipping is more, should we ship it where there's sales tax? I'm like, buddy, you're taking so much time to decide this. We're actually moving States before it will get here. So got to choose a sales tax option. So he had this whole experience of.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

It's kind of an economic awakening. Now

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Yeah, precisely. And also the lure of. Shopping and how shopping can cause you to spend more money than you think you're going to be spending. I don't think he has any regrets about his choices that he's made, particularly now that he's here in Europe and looking at how much people sell stumble guys for on the European eBay, he's like, I could make so much money reselling these.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

that's an idea I can get behind.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

But I don't think he's going to, I don't think he's going to resell them. But, you know, in terms of, of economics, he's, he's, he was very thoughtful about all of it, even though he ended up spending quite a bit more than he ever expected he would, he was pretty conscious about it. So it was, it was fascinating to watch consumerism grab hold of my child and, uh, take him for a ride.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Yeah, I think that's, there's two things that I'm really taking away from this conversation that struck me. One is the consumerism drug aspect, the adrenaline of shopping, the dopamine of shopping. I remember that feeling and it is not one. That I really have here in Europe, and then also when you're talking about hitting the ground running and the adrenaline of getting things done and that fast paceness. And that's interesting to me because recently I've been hyper aware of almost a feeling of malaise of being like, where things are so slow that you almost feel like you're treading water

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Yeah.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

and. Not that it's a bad thing, but this I think is my American response to this pace feels weird, almost unpleasant. I think it's healthier, but I don't know if I like it. And that's where it's really interesting that you're bringing that up because it's something I'm feeling on the European side. I

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

I'm, I'm quite excited to hear that you've slowed down in the month that I've been away. And I definitely want to dive into that in a future episode. And I absolutely understand what you are referring to. If I don't stay a certain degree of busy, I feel depressed

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Yeah,

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

and I feel like I am not being productive because in my mind, my value as a human being is so deeply tied to productivity, especially any kind of productivity that produces money

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

exactly. Yes.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

and it's, it's messed up.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

And it's so ingrained that it feels like a truth, not an option. The Puritan productivity is. Next to godliness. It is not an option. It is a requirement. It is such a weird, because like my logical brain can go. That doesn't make sense. We're a human being, not a human doing, but my upbringing brain says. Nope. That if you want to, basically, if you want to go to heaven, you better spend every single minute of your life producing, and it should be producing money, if not babies. Like that's what my monkey brain actually says to me. It's crazy.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Yeah, the, the ripple effect of those bloody Puritans is profound in so many ways,

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Yeah.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

so deeply.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Yeah, and I'm not saying that the old world Catholics that stayed behind and didn't populate America have it any more right, but it is definitely a different way of looking at things.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Most of them certainly have more fun than the Puritans do, whether or not they got anything right. They get to have fun.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

It's very true.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Catholicism. I grew up with, did not really, did not really permit fun to be had because anything fun was dangerous.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Well, on that note, is there anything you would like to leave our listeners with today?

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

I can't think of anything. And I'm going to attribute that to the jet lag that is still lingering.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Well then dear listeners, you'll have to form your own takeaways from today's conversation.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

There we go. There we go. I'm going to put it on the listener.

squadcaster-8a63_1_07-23-2024_135525:

Well, um, à bientôt.

aimee_1_07-23-2024_045525:

Adios.

We hope you enjoyed this episode of Bonjola. If you did, the best thing you can do is share it with another person brave enough to move abroad. See you next time!